KOSH [Kommunity Orientated Software Hardware] Weekly Summary Week Commencing: 30th January 1999 Number: 006 Mailing List: kosh-general In the mailing list this week, the following items were discussed. Please do not email the scribe regarding any of these topics, it is not his job to answer these questions, but merely to report the topics of conversation. If you have any queries about this summary, please email summaries@kosh.convergence.org, stating the Summary Number, and Mailing List Name, and he will try to answer your queries. a) Subject: Quoting Book References Summary of Debate: If anyone quotes a reference for a book that they think is relevant to anything KOSHan please could the ISBN/ISSN number (usually found on the inside front cover or a couple of pages further in) as this means that it can be ordered from almost any bookshop or library in the world. You can get information on almost any book by entering the following into a search engine like Alta Vista: (isbn+). b) Subject: Importing settings Summary of debate: Importing settings from applications on different systems to "similar" KOSH applications should be possible (Unix->KOSH via the .rc file). KOSH could have a frame for this "import settings" function which would only need a user to tell the system what type of file is being imported (if not automatically recognised) and the system would import it and fill in any blanks from pre/after-determined settings. Perhaps also exporting prefs to another system (KOSH or non-KOSH). c) Subject: Specifications Summary of debate: Multitasking and multiprocessor support should be standard in KOSH - unless anyone can think of a better way to do things. Ability to run greater than one processor in series or parallel should be included. Asymmetrical Multi Processing where the cpu's are different (eg: PPC + x86) should be supported as it is vital for distributed processing as we have envisioned it. See http://www.beowulf.org re: Beowulf Class Cluster Computers. d) Subject: Bulletproofing Summary of debate: Drivers could be made to run bulletproof with memory protection without having a separate address space. e) Subject: Performance monitoring Summary of debate: Integrating performance monitoring could be included in KOSH so that anyone can see what objects consume what system resources. However the list would be long as there would be a large number of objects. It should be possible to specify whether the only objects that are monitored are those in use, or those -mostly- in use. This would reduce overheads. Also, make it possible to put the performance monitoring entirely to sleep. By monitoring drivers in use and being able to shut them down we could add the ability to hotswap between devices such as PCI. Perhaps start a second identical kernel, and then simply switch off the old one, with the new one picking up all the work on the fly Or have multiple kernels running all the time, checking each other every few moments for proper functioning, and automatically curing bugs and crashes when they happen. A different "debugging" kernel option which offers fill check of all arguments passed to API functions and gives decent error reports when necessary could be considered. f) Subject: System idle processes Summary of debate: The system idle task on a multitasking system could do something like a limited powerdown or a limited diagnostic of components by "pinging" them. But if a task needs to be accomplished why do it when "idle", why not just implement it as a normal task? g) Subject: Survey update Summary of debate: Please send details of yourself for a KOSHan survey of those involved in -any- way with KOSH to newkirk@snip.net. Please respond as quickly as possible so that we can get some stats of KOSH participants. The final question list that is asked for is as follows: 1 - your Name & primary/preferred email 2 - your location (city/state or city/country is sufficient, more detail optional) 3 - your job(s)/career(s) (employer name optional) 4 - computers (detailed) that you currently use or own (including any customizations & significant peripherals) 5 - self-proclaimed area(s) of expertise 6 - your relevant background 7 - your 'less relevant' background (no direct perceivable connection to KOSH or computers) 8 - Why you are here 9 - what you hope for from KOSH A - Any URL you want people to visit (ideally, your own) B - What platform(s) do you think KOSH should initially target? C - What do you foresee as the most critical thing to be addressed in order for KOSH to be successful? D - What would you choose as a mascot character to symbolize KOSH? E - 'free speech' paragraph, speak your mind! h) Subject: Transferable tasks Summary of debate: It should be possible to simply transfer a task from one machine to another without any interruption or crash, to quote: "To just be able to make things float, like from one computer to another." Going beyond this, it should be possible to drag the entire user interface, windows and running applications from one KOSH machine to another. Perhaps the task could be momentarily frozen before being transferred. But would migration add bloat to an OS supporting it and require I/O systems special designed for it? Migration has been studied by various people, see: http://www.iti.mu-luebeck.de/~petri/pbeamrefs.html i) Subject: Realtime compiling Summary of debate: Perhaps get away from object files and traditional linking, With a proper system much later than KOSH-1, the development environment would be compiling and linking in realtime - as you type the code it updates the software automatically. j) Subject: Filesystem Summary of debate: KOSH should be able to but not forced to use encrypted file systems, including the swap file. k) Subject: Load balancing in distributed processing Summary of debate: It should be possible to balance the load that processes require by assigning them to the correct CPUs. Elate is an OS that can do load-balancing of dissimilar CPUs based on a nearest-neighbour algorithm. See: http://www.tao.co.uk l) Subject: AI Summary of debate: A good AI could be included to learn about the user and automatically alter carious parts of the system to make the experience of using the computer more enjoyable, but it should not be a stupid AI that annoys as many as it tries to help by (for example) doing "smart" things in word which you do not want done -every- time you use it. With current technology and the state of AI development a competent AI in KOSH is at the present time not feasible as it cannot take into account the everyday whims and moods of an individual human. If we make KOSH something you can learn simply and intuitively then the HI (Human Intelligence) can run it perfectly well and there may not be any need for an AI. It should be possible to turn off any "AI" instantly. m) Subject: Book List Summary of debate: John Chandler would like to produce a resource for everyone on the list, no matter what their skills or interests of books and articles. If you have a recommendation please email it to metaljoe@snowcrash.u-net.com with the subject "RFB Submission" including the following: Author(s), Title, Publisher, Date, ISBN/ISSN or URL, level of readership (1=novice, no experience necessary, 5=highly technical) and a brief review, maybe a paragraph or 2. Articles will need the journal title/volume/issue and maybe page numbers. If you could label submissions with a category you think is appropriate to file it under that would be helpful. If something has no general source please specify name/address/email to obtain it. Alternatively reference with the Harvard or British Standard Method styles. Two further suggestions. Check out http://www.mcp.com Macmillan Computer Publishing has several hundred of their books available online (current text and graphics). Also, KOSH could look into being set up as an Amazon.com affiliate as this could be used to raise some funds. n) Subject: Settings in containers Summary of debate: Within the container used for files, why not offer the ability to also contain the settings used to handle the contents within the associated program? IE, the container of the text editor itself could also contain the 'global' preferences settings for the editor, and the container of a specific text file could contain the settings that differ for that file. o) Subject: Operating systems list Summary of debate: http://www.cs.arizona.edu/people/bridges/oses.html many operating systems listed, free, commercial, old, new, micro kernel, and RTOS.